472>I was watching a hospital based reality show last night and there was this kid who had just a mysterious pain in his leg diagnosed as a massive bone tumor. He was a teenager and from his story, a keen soccer player, you could tell that he would have been popular at school and they showed his really pretty girlfriend, in other words he would have been in the top bracket of the population that are naturally talented and are gifted with natural charisma.
The bone tumor was big and had spread to the muscle and nerve tissue around the bone in his lower leg. The doctor was explaining to him that the only way to treat the cancer was to remove the tumor itself, the surrounding muscle and the main nerve that controls the muscles in the foot and ankle. The kid didn’t really understand and he asked the doctor how he was going to walk. The doctor gave a demonstration showing how the ankle with no muscle control will just kind of flop between strides.
At that point the look on the kids face was shocking. Just then, he realized that he was going to spend the rest of his life as a cripple. He would be in the 2 – 3% of the population with a noticeable deformity. Children will stare at him when he goes out in public and say, “Mommy, what’s wrong with that mans leg?” He realized then that he has suddenly gone from high school stud to high school cripple.
Now, in this situation a Christian can console him with clichés like, “God works in mysterious ways,” and “Only Jesus can give you the strength to overcome this ordeal,” and they can quote bible verses about good people who had bad things happen to them and how they became stronger for it, you know, a Christian can talk and talk and just the sound of their voice can comfort people in this situation, even if all they’re saying is gobbledygook.
What can an atheist say or do? They can recommend anti-depressants, I suppose, but that’s not really helping them….
Reply:Yeah, %26#039;cause %26quot;god works in mysterious ways%26quot; has helped *so* many people with their problems....
You don%26#039;t have to be religious to listen to a person%26#039;s problems, and it doesn%26#039;t take a christian to offer moral support and let them know that yeah life sucks but you have to make the most of it.
Don%26#039;t be so arrogant.
Reply:Well we could actually console him without giving him false hopes on how a cloud did this to him %26quot; and works in mysterious ways.%26quot;
Reply:I%26#039;ve never been in a situation like that so I don%26#039;t know. But if my life was changed like that, I%26#039;m not sure that I%26#039;d find %26quot;God works in mysterious ways%26quot; a comfort at all. I%26#039;d find it more comforting that I wasn%26#039;t going to die from the cancer. I%26#039;d be relieved that nothing worse was going to happen to me than one crippled leg.
Reply:I usually say something along the lines of %26quot;There are people out there in much worse a condition than you, so stop feeling sorry for yourself and be happy that you are alive at all.%26quot; It may not be as sugar-coated as %26quot;God loves you and has a plan for your enormous bone tumor%26quot; , but it gets the job done.
Reply:I think, that that point, there is nothing that a person can say. At that point %26quot;God works in mysterious ways%26quot; or something similar would ring rather hollow.
Reply:We can tell him that he%26#039;s strong enough, with the support of friends and family, to get through it. We can tell him about the many people who persevered with their own strength of character through adversity.
We can point out to you that there%26#039;s no evidence of god or Jesus ever helping anyone ever.
Reply:If I was that kid and the christian tries to console me I would fall asleep or get pissed and bored.
Reply:My favorite is %26quot;just go with the flow%26quot;
well...
the god works in mysterious ways is stupid, im sorry.
but anyways, sometimes you fall, the only thing you can ddo is get back up and keep going.
dont let what other people think of you get you down.
its your life not your leg that counts.(this comes from the bull rider side of me)
the higher you are the harder you fall, and the bigger the splat. Now all you can do is reclimb that mountain and hope you dont fall again.
Reply:I shall not recite %26quot;gobbledygook%26quot; as you say it. no matter how sick my child is. i will not lie to him.
Reply:Well, an atheist can say %26quot;they are%26quot;, instead of %26quot;their%26quot; when it is correct.
Reply:My heart is just as warm as yours is. My arms can reach around a person just like yours can. I can laugh, cry, feel pain and empathize, just like you can.
So, I dont lie and tell them stupid stuff like %26quot;God has a plan!%26quot;, because I cannot for the life of me figure out what kind of plan a God might have in taking away a person%26#039;s ability to enjoy their life. I dont WANT TO know that kind of God.
Reply:They can encourage him to overcome this disability with hard work, discipline, will power and faith in himself and apply his talent in a new and creative way. Perhaps speaking to other similarly affected kids and encouraging them to go and do and work around their disabilities and enjoy life to the fullest....
Just a guess.....
Reply:Blaming god for your fate is not a whole heck of a lot better than saying something stupid like %26quot;You are one unlucky dude.%26quot;
Consolation is not so much about finding a reason as it is about helping someone cope with a turn of the cards that puts you out of the game.
My cousin lost an infant son and theists kept trying to tell him that the child was %26quot;in a better place%26quot;. This was no consolation (either then, or now). An atheist would not do that and an empathetic atheist (yes, there are some) would have found another way to offer comfort.
Surprisingly, we atheists can be a helpful group even in times of sorrow.
Reply:Dying Christians are more terrified of death than anyone! They think they MIGHT go to %26quot;hell%26quot;, as opposed to a non-believer, who KNOWS they won%26#039;t.
Reply:I%26#039;d tell him we could amputate his leg and give him a prosthetic. He would be able to walk normally, play soccer, and with the prosthetics nowadays, most people wouldn%26#039;t be able to tell its fake. But thats just me.
Reply:At least we don%26#039;t have to tell him that God hates him so much that he%26#039;s letting his leg get eaten up by cancer.
But you are right, when someone sneezes and believers tell them %26quot;God bless you%26quot; I am really at a loss.
Reply:I admit that atheists are at a terrible disadvantage when consoling a person , or their family during the time preceding a death . Not much you can do about it . I don%26#039;t want to lie just to make a person feel better . (e.g. telling little Jimmy that his sick dog had to go to a farm far away in order to get better .)But it is a difficult situation for us .
But in the example you provided where there is just a difficulty to overcome ( We ALL have them at one time or another ) reality and truth works just fine . I remember a M.A.S.H. episode where a pianist lost one of his hands in the war . Charles encouraged him to play one handed just as another great composer had . It was truth and HUMAN care and compassion that came to the young man%26#039;s aid . Not belief in a fairy tale .
Reply:Easily. Just tell them the truth.
He is much better off in this way, in that, without removing the tumor, he could have died. You do not need to be especially spry or play soccer to be successful or to feel fulfilled in life. And, the best part: if he is naturally charismatic, that should not fade away with him. In fact, having overcome this ordeal with life intact, his character will be strengthened (if he can overcome the initial difficulties of being different and having to hobble around) and will in time be as happy, or even happier than his peers.
We massively overestimate how much a disability like this affects long-term disposition. Given a year or two, or even a few months, to adjust, people in such a position to rebound from whatever fears or sorrows they have, and get on with their life in ways better than people who suffer from depression for things that have no actual cause.
Reply:and how is quoting the bible going to help?
it%26#039;s not.
comforting someone isn%26#039;t about words - it%26#039;s about actions. you can talk all day and say all kinds of things. that%26#039;s not helpful. what is helpful is simply being with someone as they face difficulty. i would rather hold someone%26#039;s hand than throw meaningless words around.
Reply:I would say an atheist would be more of an ADVANTAGE to the kid. We could talk to him truthfully, empathize with his situation, offer help and support to him, show him how to adjust and live as normal a life as possible. That would be a greater help to such a kid than giving him a lot of senseless phrases that mean nothing and do no real good. I am surprised you didn%26#039;t offer up the old %26#039;pray for Jesus to take the tumor away%26#039; bit.
Reply:I think those at a disadvantage would be those without much life experience to draw on, regardless of religious ties. Once you%26#039;ve been through some stuff in your life -- loss, death, disease, disability, injustice... you gain the resources to help others through their hardships. At the very least, you can say: %26quot;Yes, this hurts, but people get through it and so will you. And you%26#039;ll come out the other side of this experience a stronger, wiser person. And I will be someone you can rely on to listen, and to help you get through it.%26quot;
Reply:And you have explained the foundation of religion. Lies and false hope. People tend to find it at their lowest because it%26#039;s when they%26#039;re the most vulnerable. The religious predators know this so they seek out the desperate.
And my method of consolation in the one I use all the time:
Toughen up because sh!t happens. You can be strong and fight through this or you can be a pus$y and cry. Which one%26#039;s it gonna be?
Reply:your asumption that atheists can not console someone because we do not believe in god is idiotic and ignorant. he is human and his condition is that of human nature. why on earth would we build up his hopes about god making him stronger only for him to realize this isnt the case? he is human and should be treated like one and not be made a fool of. we are perfectly capable of becoming stronger and happier on our own and we do not need to credit an imaginary god. seriously, grow up already.
another thing, the pearl of wisdom, %26quot;god works in mysterious ways%26quot; doesn%26#039;t cut it and it isnt comforting. telling someone that an all loving person hates you in particular wouldnt exactly make me want to do cartwheels.
Losing Teeth
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